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    The Guardian | Rutger Bregman | 5/9/20 | 14 min
    42 reads21 comments
    9.3
    The Guardian
    42 reads
    9.3
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    • sathishpaul3 weeks ago

      Loved the ending take away: “Life has taught me a great deal,” it began, “including the lesson that you should always look for what is good and positive in people.”

    • gmclean3 weeks ago

      Heartening to find the movement of science towards positivity and compassion, much needed.

      • Karenz3 weeks ago

        I read Lord of the Flies in high school or college and remember being horrified. I certainly prefer this version. I agree with all comments that stress the importance of these boys’ upbringing and schooling. Any parent has first hand experience of the need for children to be taught kindness and sharing by example and instruction.

    • Tonianni3 weeks ago

      Heartwarming turn of events! I’m surprised though that the Author is trying to pitch Lord of the Flies like it’s an impossibility. So far, it is observable in the world that humans are capable of both great good and great evil. Plus I didn’t realise Lord of the Flies was taken so seriously by people as “how humans will always behave on a deserted island”

      Another thing is, these Tongan boys were no strangers to islands, they had a Christian and cultural background that emphasises love and community over selfishness. Let’s not think this is the norm worldwide, it is something that has to be taught. And because it is taught, we must ask ourselves why? Errhm because clearly we are not born this way!

      • thorgalle3 weeks ago

        Good comment! It's true, there's probably a lot of important background to this story that wasn't covered. And extremities should not be generalized, whether they are good or bad.

        Still, I think we can say that (social) media usually emphasize the bad stuff today. Highlighting the other side once in a while is a refreshing thing.

        • Tonianni3 weeks ago

          We certainly need more stories of good, hope & love :)

    • Liz
      Scout
      3 weeks ago

      A beautiful and groundbreaking story about the nature of humanity. I teach Lord of the Flies to my students and this is the perfect antidote to assumptions about toxic masculinity or the evil in humanity.

      • Tonianni3 weeks ago

        Why is it groundbreaking??? Have you never cooperated or helped others before?

        • jeff
          Top reader this weekReading streakScoutScribe
          3 weeks ago

          I think it's an appropriate categorization given the opening context of the article:

          For centuries western culture has been permeated by the idea that humans are selfish creatures.

          Granted, I would have liked some more elaboration from the author on that point.

          Where I'm from at least the Lord of the Flies is something almost everyone reads in school at a young age and as such kind of establishes a narrative of "this is what happens in the absence of authority." A rather unfortunate fallacy that hopefully stops being repeated thanks to articles like this one bringing more awareness to the origins of the book and real life counter-examples.

          • jbuchana
            Scribe
            3 weeks ago

            The Stanford Prison Experiment is often cited in this context.

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment

            • thorgalle3 weeks ago

              Just pointing out: that experiment has also been criticized for having serious validity issues, to the point that the findings are really not representative of anything.

              See also the "criticism and response" section in the Wikipedia article you linked. I remember listening to this interesting podcast about it: http://rationallyspeakingpodcast.org/show/rs-241-thibault-le-texier-on-debunking-the-stanford-prison-e.html, where an important critic (Thibault Le Texier) laments that however high-quality their critique is, this experiment has been mentioned so much that they can't destroy its embeddedness in culture anymore.

          • Tonianni3 weeks ago

            It is good to see stories that give hope and highlight the good in our world but I’m surprised though that the Author is trying to pitch Lord of the Flies like it’s an impossibility.

            So far, it is observable in the world that humans are capable of both great good and great evil. Plus I didn’t realise Lord of the Flies was taken so seriously by people as “how humans will always behave on a deserted island”

            Another thing is, these Tongan boys were no strangers to islands, they had a Christian and cultural background that emphasises love and community over selfishness. Let’s not think this is the norm worldwide, it is something that has to be taught. And because it is taught, we must ask ourselves why? Errhm because clearly we are not born this way!

    • Abarlet3 weeks ago

      My takeaway is that truth is better than fiction.

    • Plum3 weeks ago

      This was important for me, it fave me hope. It is important to think about how the boys were raised and learn from that

    • Kiki3 weeks ago

      A positive outlook in these negative times.

    • deephdave
      Top reader this weekReading streakScout
      3 weeks ago

      “Life has taught me a great deal,” it began, “including the lesson that you should always look for what is good and positive in people.”

    • jbuchana
      Scribe
      3 weeks ago

      An uplifting story, this makes me feel good.

    • Florian
      Reading streak
      3 weeks ago

      The real Lord of the Flies is a tale of friendship and loyalty; one that illustrates how much stronger we are if we can lean on each other.

      More relevant than ever

    • slapdash3 weeks ago

      What a delightful doze of optimism at a time when humanity is being tore down with nonsense politics and self righteousness.

    • jeff
      Top reader this weekReading streakScoutScribe
      3 weeks ago

      What an epic story! It's super impressive how well the boys held up. They must have been psyched to find those chickens. We humans never would have made it this far if we weren't cooperative by nature.

    • thorgalle3 weeks ago

      What a story! I love how it starts from a question and develops into an unbelievable adventure (both for the author and the boys).

      I'd have liked to see more details on life on the island, but that was not the point of the article.

      I got lured in to read this after spotting the author name (and title). I remember Bregman from him cutting to the chase at the rich on the World Economic Forum (YouTube, it's gold).

      This is definitely a good teaser for his book too. It's been long ago that I was excited to read a Dutch original book (my first language).